Speculation: 2014 Offseason - Roster Building / Trade Speculation Thread
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JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,071
- 17,712
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
He's currently our best asset. Saw him a couple times at Hartford this year. Great pure offensive skills. Needs defensive work.
Treff has him ranked as our best prospect. He most certainly does not suck.
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
If they're trading O'Reilly for a year of Staal, they're gonna need to be left with something wayyyy nicer than Danny fricken Kristo.
Well we'd be trading for ROR's rights... the right to having him as a 23 y/o entitled head ache.
Plenty of players show flashes and go down the tube when they get their pay day. Giving 6.5 mill for 5-6 years to a 23 year old is a bigger risk than giving that 6.5 mill to a more veteran player.
It's not like we're getting a sure thing.
And it's also not like Staal wouldn't be willing to resign in Colorado, if of course they gave him ample money - something they'll be able to due looking at their lax cap. Colorado is a certainly not a dump. It used to be one of the most exciting hockey teams and towns to play and live in. They're certainly making a comeback, with a coach that the players have seriously bought into, with unbelievable young talent... and it's totally conceivable that they'll be able to retain Staal for a while after they get him.
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
I agree, Staal would be bonkers to leave that studded team to go dick around with his bros in Raleigh. But if ROR is on the block, I'd imagine there will be better offers than 1 year of Staal, it would take a lot more than Danny Kristo as a fail-safe, IMO.
Kristo turns 24 tomorrow, and has yet to play a single NHL game.
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,071
- 17,712
I completely disagree with Leslie's rankings, then. I saw Kristo play myself, and while he has good hands, good wheels, and is a decent finisher, I saw nothing that screamed "top prospect" to me, even in an organization that lacks "top" prospect talent like this one. His play away from the puck (in every zone) is embarrassing.
No way he should be ranked over Miller, Skjei, McIlrath, Lindberg, Fast or Duke.
Again, why does it have to be a year? And again, we'd be getting his rights. What's to say that we're not trading for a year of him, too?
If he's pulling this **** off for the Avs... what's to stop him from pulling it off on the next team he's on? 6.5 for a 23 y/o who's posted 1 season above 60 points? If he was on our team we'd be begging for him to have his ass shipped out. Would you have dreamt of giving McD a 6 year deal worth 6.5 mill before the season? What if he wanted it, wasn't getting it, and pulling the same **** that ROR is doing now and did last offseason?
We're not getting the next Gretzky here. Staal's value is nearly equivalent to ROR's if given the same term of years under contract. ROR is a 2nd line center, Staal is a 2nd line defender. Both show flashes of greatness. Both show some mental lapses that prevent them from greatness on a consistent basis.
We're trying to add depth, they're trying to add defense. The core pieces match up. In addition, they get our best prospect? Should be a no-brainer for them.
Rutherford is gone. New GM is looking to shed cap. E. Staal could be the first to go. So much for Staal super team.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
Well, give O'Reilly the money he wants long-term, for better or worse, and he won't be going anywhere. Going to need to find a Top 6 center this offseason if we're going to legitimately contend again next season, IMO.
The conditionals would still need to be much more appetizing for the Avs than Kristo, that's for sure.
The conditionals would still need to be much more appetizing for the Avs than Kristo, that's for sure.
GregSirico
KakkoSZN
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
What's the difference between a 25 year old underachieving for his contract and a 33 year old doing the same?
We're going to probably have to give a little bit to get ROR. We likely aren't getting him for cheap.
Colorado could throw in someone like Elliot as well.
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
He's 23 and still has plenty of time to become an even better player, much like Stepan. You know what you're getting with a 33-year-old center, who would probably be leaving his prime as well.
We're not gonna find a #1C that will come risk-free.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
I was talking about years down the road, where our current overpaid center is sitting in his contract. I like ROR and would be willing to pay him... just not pay him whatever he wants.
I responded to hyperbole with deadpan. I should have expected this.
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,071
- 17,712
Meh, maybe suck wasn't the right word. But he definitely did not impress me at all.
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
Well, signing young players longterm, who have potential, but haven't proven all that much, is inherently a bit risky. The payoff would be a 1-2-punch of ROR/Stepan, both entering their primes at more or less the same time. When players like this become available at this stage in their career, it's worth taking the chance, IMO.
If he doesn't impress some Rangers fans, how would the Avs react?
If he doesn't impress some Rangers fans, how would the Avs react?
I don't think being a GM is as simple as... well give him the money and....
At the end of the day, the guy is a 23 y/o, who thinks he is entitled to star money... when he's had 1 year of over 60 points.
Is 60 points now the norm to be able to ***** and whine and throw tantrums over the difference between a 5.5 mill contract and one worth 6.5?
Is the precedent the Rangers want to set to be trading core guys because our salary is tight while trading for someone elses guys and paying them obscene cash when they might not even deserve it?
Is that the precedent that any team wants? And while i'm sure some team(s) may be stupid enough to do it, Colorado is not in rebuild mode any longer. They're looking to take the next step. Meaning they'll want a "stud defenseman" back in return. One that can take them past the first round in the playoffs.
So Staal, to me, really is the prize for them. And while 1 year may not be enough to do it straight up, it shouldn't mean we give the prospect that is most developed and primed to make an impact additionally. The difference simply is not great enough. What happens if they get that and Staal resigns? Would we get anything additionally? Probably not. We get a guy who we will probably pay and keep in the long term. They get a guy who if they pay will probably stay long term... but since there is slightly more risk than we have, we give them a prospect with a high ceiling who needs more development than another one of our prospects. The risk is what would make the deal more favorable for them, in terms of the package they are getting, and I don't think the risk is high enough to warrant what in my opinion is our best and more developed prospect.
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
TBH, 60 points seems like an arbitrary number in this instance. His PPG has been the same as Stepan's for the last 3 seasons. Giving him a big, long term deal includes his potential. Like I said, longterm deal's that are in part paying for potential are inherently risky, but high-reward.
He's been a great player for the Avs, I don't really give a **** about his personality if he's an important player for the team. Cally wanted a ton of money too, and he was a very good leader for us. Another young center who had never eclipsed 60 points prior to being dealt, and also had a questionable attitude: Tyler Seguin.
Also, on Kristo: "most developed and primed to make an impact" doesn't speak to me positively. He turns 24 tomorrow, and still hasn't played his first NHL game. Kristo would be an essentially meaningless trade addition from the Avs point of view, IMO. 24-year-old forward who's never even had a cup of coffee, and despite that is already on his 2nd NHL team. Never really understood the Danny Kristo hype TBH, but I guess we'll just wait and see. Plus, he's Killem's favorite prospect.
Whoever we acquire [if we do] for the #1/#2C spot, the deal will most likely have a risk, and/or overpayment attached to it. I'd rather take the chance on ROR than any other guys out there. Of course, maybe JT Miller pans out wonderfully and we can slot him at #2C/#3C, although I'd feel sort of 'iffy' about rolling with Stepan/Brassard as our 1-2 if we're going to try and compete next season.
He's been a great player for the Avs, I don't really give a **** about his personality if he's an important player for the team. Cally wanted a ton of money too, and he was a very good leader for us. Another young center who had never eclipsed 60 points prior to being dealt, and also had a questionable attitude: Tyler Seguin.
Also, on Kristo: "most developed and primed to make an impact" doesn't speak to me positively. He turns 24 tomorrow, and still hasn't played his first NHL game. Kristo would be an essentially meaningless trade addition from the Avs point of view, IMO. 24-year-old forward who's never even had a cup of coffee, and despite that is already on his 2nd NHL team. Never really understood the Danny Kristo hype TBH, but I guess we'll just wait and see. Plus, he's Killem's favorite prospect.
Whoever we acquire [if we do] for the #1/#2C spot, the deal will most likely have a risk, and/or overpayment attached to it. I'd rather take the chance on ROR than any other guys out there. Of course, maybe JT Miller pans out wonderfully and we can slot him at #2C/#3C, although I'd feel sort of 'iffy' about rolling with Stepan/Brassard as our 1-2 if we're going to try and compete next season.
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It is a fact. If you get traded with one year left on a deal, you're a rental. You can certainly re sign but you are trading for an unsigned player.
ROR is not a rental because his rights are maintained for two more years. But you guys can believe the pipe dream if you want. If we're getting him, it's for more than Staal, and we still have to sign him, and our defense would be in big trouble. You guys like the idea of Moore as our #4? Because I don't.
It's not worth it. Rather sign Stastny but I don't see him picking us. Seems more of a quiet, small market player.
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