Speculation: 2014 Offseason - Roster Building / Trade Speculation Thread II ‎

[Raspewtin]

I never said I wanted Stastny first of all.. 2nd of all I woudn't trade Staal for either one..

I would however trade Staal if it could get someone like ROR.

and Brassard is a #2, the same way Derek Stepan is a #1.. he's not.

I bet you think ROR is a #1 center.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I never said I wanted Stastny first of all.. 2nd of all I woudn't trade Staal for either one..

I would however trade Staal if it could get someone like ROR.

and Brassard is a #2, the same way Derek Stepan is a #1.. he's not.

Brassard is more of a 2C than John Moore is a #2 LD. See how the dominoes fall?

I'd love to improve at center drastically, but Im just trying to be realistic with you.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

If not Brassard, then who? And where is the money coming from to pay that player? We're tight on cap space as it is.

I do not know. But I think come November/December, Brassard will be antagonized if that amount of responsibility is given to him.

We all thought he was ready to take the next step beginning this season. He was put on the 2nd line. Completely tanked.

Put on the 3rd line. Completely tanked until Zucc found his way on that line.

He's a good depth player, but that's all. He's a great 3c. Contributed to our overall depth because he was able to take advantage of lesser competition.

That will not happen on the 2nd line.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

I bet you think ROR is a #1 center.

No, but he's also 22 and will get better, and he's also one of the best defensive centers in the game.. If you had a Bergeron/Krejci (neither a true #1) would you complain?

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

Brassard is more of a 2C than John Moore is a #2 LD. See how the dominoes fall?

I'd love to improve at center drastically, but Im just trying to be realistic with you.

They could maybe sign someone to play the 2nd pair LHD.. I dunno, but there are options out there is all I'm saying..

 

[GAGLine]

Which would be a mistake. Unless Stepan puts up 70-75 points, and Brassard can up his point totals to like 60.

It's not a mistake if there aren't any better alternatives. We don't have the cap space or the assets required to get a better top 6 center than Brass. The best we can hope for is that we can target a young player that can grow into that spot in a couple years.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I don't see where we can improve in other area's, though.

We're taking a step down purely in terms of who are 2c is. Brassard in a good year (this year) wasn't able to get to where Richards was on a bad year.

What can Miller do in his first full rookie season?

Let's say, best case, he posts a season similar to Kreider's campaign this year... Kreider posted .56 ppg.

46 points. Brassard was at 45. So we're taking a hit on the 2nd line, and best case remaining equal on the 3rd line? That's just too much to hope for.

What about blue line offense? 5 guys put up 75 points. That's unacceptable. Un ****ing acceptable.

It would be great to keep as many of these guys as possible, but there need to be some improvements in places. Maximize value on a few players. Some tough decisions need to be made.

Youre just looking at points, which is incredibly simplistic. You dont think Brassard could put up 50+ points getting the same opportunities the incredibly inefficient Brad Richards got? Thats addition by subtraction as far as Im concerned.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

It's not a mistake if there aren't any better alternatives. We don't have the cap space or the assets required to get a better top 6 center than Brass. The best we can hope for is that we can target a young player that can grow into that spot in a couple years.

considering the 3 guys we need to retain the most are all RFAS... I don't agree with this part....

and we also have guys who can step into similar roles IMO for cheaper than the alternatives.

 

[Vitto79]

Which would be a mistake. Unless Stepan puts up 70-75 points, and Brassard can up his point totals to like 60.

They need to get young guys like miller in the rotation . Kid will be a good 3rd line C w some offense

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

They need to get young guys like miller in the rotation . Kid will be a good 3rd line C w some offense

why couldn't he play 3rd line RW with Zucc and Brass?.. just a thought.. he's also played Wing.. I agree he would be more value at the 3C spot, but there are options.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

It's not a mistake if there aren't any better alternatives. We don't have the cap space or the assets required to get a better top 6 center than Brass. The best we can hope for is that we can target a young player that can grow into that spot in a couple years.

Even Kadri would be an improvement on the 2nd line, over Brassard.

He's available. He was available last year. He's going to be available if the Maple Leafs tank again. Changes will be made.

What about Granlund on the Wild?

Scheifele in Wpg, who is about to fire sale?

It doesn't have to be Thornton, Spezza, Stastny, or ROR. But there are better options that Brassard there.

 

[GAGLine]

considering the 3 guys we need to retain the most are all RFAS... I don't agree with this part....

and we also have guys who can step into similar roles IMO for cheaper than the alternatives.

Really? Who are we replacing Zucc, Brass and Kreider with? They are all RFAs, but they are arbitration eligible RFAs, a concept you don't seem to understand.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

Youre just looking at points, which is incredibly simplistic. You dont think Brassard could put up 50+ points getting the same opportunities the incredibly inefficient Brad Richards got? Thats addition by subtraction as far as Im concerned.

Richards TOI
Season. 18:41
Playoffs. 17:01

Brassard TOI..
Season. 15:48
Playoffs. 15:47..

Not an astronomical difference... However, Richards also got to play with Nash at times (who wasn't great though) as well as MSL most of the time, so you could have a point there.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Youre just looking at points, which is incredibly simplistic. You dont think Brassard could put up 50+ points getting the same opportunities the incredibly inefficient Brad Richards got? Thats addition by subtraction as far as Im concerned.

Considering that Callahan had 25 points on Richards' line before he was traded, Hagelin has had 33 points on the 2nd line this year, and MSL had 7 points from when he was traded till the end of the season... accounting for 65 points on the 2nd line for Brad's line mates.

And Zucc had 59 points and Poo had 36, which is a good 30 points more than Brad's linemates... i'd argue that the better chances came for Brassard's line and he still put up worse numbers than Brad.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Even Kadri would be an improvement on the 2nd line, over Brassard.

He's available. He was available last year. He's going to be available if the Maple Leafs tank again. Changes will be made.
.

Hes available because hes an inconsistent jerk-off.

The only world where he is a better option than Brassard is the shiny new toy alternate reality that this board devolves into every off-season.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

Really? Who are we replacing Zucc, Brass and Kreider with? They are all RFAs, but they are arbitration eligible RFAs, a concept you don't seem to understand.

I said the 3 guys WE NEED TO KEEP are all RFAS.. Not everyone will or should be retained if there are cheaper alternatives. and I'm very aware of the arbitration.. Zucc is really the only one with a case. How much are centers who put up 45 points awarded? Qualify Brassard and re evaluate.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Hes available because hes an inconsistent jerk-off.

The only world where he is a better option than Brassard is the shiny new toy alternate reality that this board devolves into every off-season.

He averaged nearly a ppg last year.

He scored as many points as Brad playing on a team that as a whole tanked - not just him.

He has the potential to be a 70 pt player on a more dominant team.

 

[GAGLine]

Even Kadri would be an improvement on the 2nd line, over Brassard.

He's available. He was available last year. He's going to be available if the Maple Leafs tank again. Changes will be made.

What about Granlund on the Wild?

Scheifele in Wpg, who is about to fire sale?

It doesn't have to be Thornton, Spezza, Stastny, or ROR. But there are better options that Brassard there.

So Wpg is going to rebuild and trade away their prized young center? Minnesota is going to trade Granlund? And no, I wouldn't say that Kadri is better than Brassard, or at least not better enough to be worth what it would cost to get him.

This is shiny new toy syndrome, nothing else.

 

[Raspewtin]

No, but he's also 22 and will get better, and he's also one of the best defensive centers in the game.. If you had a Bergeron/Krejci (neither a true #1) would you complain?

No, absolutely not.

You talk about ROR and how he can keep getting better, you realize Stepan is only a year older? He hasn't stagnated.

Which is my point, this "we need a mystical #1 center that's good at everything but pretty much never available" shtick needs to stop. A 1-2 punch of ROR and Step, or Step and Kadri would be great.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

Also, lets keep in mind, this is now AV's team so he's going to get input in who he wants to retain.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

No, absolutely not.

You talk about ROR and how he can keep getting better, you realize Stepan is only a year older? He hasn't stagnated.

Which is my point, this "we need a mystical #1 center that's good at everything but pretty much never available" shtick needs to stop. A 1-2 punch of ROR and Step, or Step and Kadri would be great.

I dont think Stepan has the skill set to ever get to a true #1.. but he can get better certainly.. I think ROR has the skill set to become a #1.. or at least better than Stepan.. but again, it's not about having one dynamite guy at the top, I'd just as gladly take 2 60 point guys at the top, but I dont think Brassard is or will ever be that.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

So Wpg is going to rebuild and trade away their prized young center? Minnesota is going to trade Granlund? And no, I wouldn't say that Kadri is better than Brassard, or at least not better enough to be worth what it would cost to get him.

This is shiny new toy syndrome, nothing else.

Kadri, in 48 games, nearly matched Brassard's highest regular season performance. He outperformed him with worse line mates this year. So that's just bias on your part.

Scheifele... is not exempt from the Wpg GM's statement of "we're listening to offers on any player".

Granlund would probably cost Staal, but he's also another guy set to break out soon.

So take your pick. Trade Staal in an effort to get a younger guy on the cusp who will be cheaper in AAV... or trade other assets for higher priced options.

Brassard won't cut it. I'd love to save these posts and see how you guys are reacting in November. Brassard isn't magically going to become a 60 point player because you guys say he will... or because we can't afford a guy that can. He is what he is, 45 point player who excels on the 3rd line. Catastrophic if he's 2c.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Kadri, in 48 games, nearly matched Brassard's highest regular season performance. He outperformed him with worse line mates this year. So that's just bias on your part.

Scheifele... is not exempt from the Wpg GM's statement of "we're listening to offers on any player".

Granlund would probably cost Staal, but he's also another guy set to break out soon.

So take your pick. Trade Staal in an effort to get a younger guy on the cusp who will be cheaper in AAV... or trade other assets for higher priced options.

Brassard won't cut it. I'd love to save these posts and see how you guys are reacting in November. Brassard isn't magically going to become a 60 point player because you guys say he will... or because we can't afford a guy that can. He is what he is, 45 point player who excels on the 3rd line. Catastrophic if he's 2c.

Apparently you'd also like to see the Rangers **** themselves by getting a guy in here you can slot over Brassard because he has a higher PPG average.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Apparently you'd also like to see the Rangers **** themselves by getting a guy in here you can slot over Brassard because he has a higher PPG average.

**** themselves by selling high on a guy when his value is set to drop? I call that being opportunistic.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

Apparently you'd also like to see the Rangers **** themselves by getting a guy in here you can slot over Brassard because he has a higher PPG average.

So then we can't bring anyone in here better than Brassard because they can't hack it.. and we can't win with brassard as the #2 center.. so either way we're ****ed.. nice.