Speculation: 2014 - 2015 New York Rangers :: Roster building / proposal thread Part III
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Top 5 college free agents
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Hayes is a big boy. 6'4" and 220 lbs is a massive frame. Would love to add him to the top 9. But I don't see a fit unless they move Stempniak to the 4th line and I'm not sure thats a smart move given Stemp's pretty overall sound game plus experience. If only Hayes was a center.
BBKers
Registered User
Top 3 lines looking good on paper at least with a pending Hayes signing - unlikely IMO though - however this would likely be at the end of the year though as the lineup and lines would be different to start the year. Adds size and youth lost in the past years trades which would be very valuable out of an organizational "needs perspective". If Hayes cannot be had maybe adding Penner on the cheap could be a good stop gap option for depth.
Kreider - Miller - Hayes
Zucc - Brassard - Nash
Hagelin - Step - MSL
Glass - Moore - Stempniak
Lombardi or Carcillo as the spare
LOTs of younger callup options
Very good depth
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I don't see Hayes making the team either out of camp. But on the other hand. We were too small last season. Right? Everyone talked about it -- a lot.
Since then, we lost our -- three -- best power forwards. We have taken a team that was too small and too soft during the regular season, that has lost our three best power forwards, and replaced them with 5'7-5'11 players.
Cally, Pouliot and Boyle out, MSL and a mix of Stemp, Lombardi and Fast in...
You wanna bet that there will be a lot of talk that will start sooner rather than later about us being too small this season?
On the farm, all our prospects are -- dadadadrumdrum -- small. So any kid that is 6'4 220lbs scoring 1.5+ PPG in the NCAA, is going to get looked at and is hardly going to be forgotten...
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
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Zil
Shrug
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Are all of our prospects Anthony Duclair? Do at least a little research on this stuff. Count the small guys in our voted top 15:
Miller - 6'1" 205 lb
Skjei - 6'3" 206 lb
Duclair - 5'11" 185 lb
McIlrath - 6'5" 230 lb
Fast - 6'0" 185 lb
Buchnevich - 6'1" 176 lb (weight reportedly on the way up, plays physical)
Lindberg - 6'1" 190 lb
Allen - 6'1" 210 lb
Kristo - 6'0" 195 lb
Haggerty - 6'0" 200 lb
Halverson - Goalie won't be hitting anyone, but he's big
Tambellini - 6'2" 179 lb (weight reportedly on the way up, plays physical)
Hrivik - 6'2" 200 lb
Nieves - 6'3" 192 lb
Graves - 6'4" 220 lb
Duclair's the only guy under 6' and he's only 5 pounds off Callahan's playing weight. Fast is the only other player who projects to be fairly slight as an NHLer. The 14 skaters are split evenly between guys over and under 200 lb. Lindberg, Kristo, and Nieves are within 10 of 200 lb as well. And I'd expect Nieves, Tambellini, and Buchnevich to continue doing a lot of filling out.
We have some smaller long shots in the lower end of the pool (Bourque, Walcott, Nanne), but the top guys we're hoping to make it are not cut from this mold.
I think you're underestimating the center position and/or overestimating the depth of the center position on for the Rangers.
There is no way Kreider gets moved away from guys like Stepan and Nash to play with UNPROVEN players in Miller and Hayes. That is just silly. HE is our best power forward. He needs to be with quality players, our best players. And I find it amazing that people have Hayes penciled in a top 9 so easily. The NHL is a lot different than the NCAA. The game is a lot quicker. His big frame is nice and all but nothing is automatic. When I said we probably wouldnt have a spot in the top 9 on this team it was me viewing him as being the 9th forward. And imo I see him as needing to be able to play in our top 9 for him to sign here over places like Calgary and Florida who will likely have him their top 9 easily.
Also Callahan is not a power forward.
Pouliot is a big body who disappeared all too often over the course of 82 games. He isn't exactly a power forward. He played close to it in the playoffs but lets not act like he is this force out their
Boyle is the closest out of the 3 Ola mentioned. But we all know his problem, he doesnt fully use his size to his advantage. He doesnt get enough garbage goals. He doesnt power his way to the net enough. He'll stand in front of the net but that doesnt necessarily make him a power forward.
MSL off sets losing those bigger bodies with his ability to score.
Kreider is our best power forward.
Stempniak essentially replaces what Boyle gave us at a smallet frame and quite honestly probably puts up more offense than Boyle this year.
Also Callahan is not a power forward.
Pouliot is a big body who disappeared all too often over the course of 82 games. He isn't exactly a power forward. He played close to it in the playoffs but lets not act like he is this force out their
Boyle is the closest out of the 3 Ola mentioned. But we all know his problem, he doesnt fully use his size to his advantage. He doesnt get enough garbage goals. He doesnt power his way to the net enough. He'll stand in front of the net but that doesnt necessarily make him a power forward.
MSL off sets losing those bigger bodies with his ability to score.
Kreider is our best power forward.
Stempniak essentially replaces what Boyle gave us at a smallet frame and quite honestly probably puts up more offense than Boyle this year.
I haven't seen enough Stempniak over the years to say definitively, but I'm guessing Boyle brought a bit more of a physical presence (an effective one) than will Stempniak. Boyle used his body. He helped pin pucks in the offensive zone. Also, if Stempniak ends up being a top 9 forward, and he doesn't play with Moore, you're comparing Stempniak to Pouliot, and not to Boyle, and if he is with, say, Brassard, he better bring more points than did Boyle.
I dont agree. First off callahan wasnt a power forward neither was boyle even though boyle was a big guy he wanst what you call a power forward. Now i would say cally and boyle were our 2 better Penalty Killers that would be more accurate. Also in regards to Pouliot i understand he had his best season BUT he was still wildly inconsistent and he benftted from playing with zucc and brass. Edmonton was out of their minds giving him that contract.
Mac n Gs
Drury plz
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If you add up the size and grit Callahan, Boyle and Pouliot brought and compared to their three replacements, what was lost is more than what came in, so in essence, this team is likely a bit softer than last season's team. Will it be more skilled and quick though and will that be a net positive? I think that's the point trying to be made. Along the boards may not be where the Rangers want to play this season.
BBKers
Registered User
Please read My post before bashing. I concur there is no way that Hayes gets a top 9 roll or even an NHL spot to begin with. However at the end of the year or next year I think this would be the foundation for a very nice homegrown pure American line encompassing speed + size + skill together with youth. Kreider and Miller have played well together in the past as we'll. no reason to think this could not be a huge factor for the Blue in the future (provided Hayes signs and pans out)
If Kreider is doing well this season and is looking like a 25-30 goal scorer, I don't think there'd be any reason to take him away from Stepan.
BBKers
Registered User
eco's bones
Registered User
Ola was talking about for the coming season. Duclair is most likely going back to the Q--Skjei's going back to Minnesota U.--Buchnevich to the KHL--Tambellini to the WHL and no he's not really a physical player--Graves is but he's going back to the Q as well--Nieves will be back at Michigan U.
Kristo and Fast are not 6'0 players. Both are kind of lightweights besides. The two obvious players that we know of on your list who combine size with some aggression are Miller and McIlrath and Allen and Haggerty are maybe's. Allen actually had 5 or 6 fights in Hartford last year though like Gordie Clark pointed out recently--the division Hartford plays in fights more than any other.
Not bashing. Simply being reasonable. Even if youre talking about the end of this upcoming season or the next one (which we arent looking at given the title of this thread), i think you are really setting your expectations way too high if you believe a player who hasnt been able to stick in the NHL yet (Miller) and a player who hasnt even played a pro game yet (Hayes) will be getting top 6 minutes with a guy like Kreider. That's utterly ridiculous. Like Fletch said, if Kreider is producing it is likely with Stepan where he has had success and chemistry with.
I also agree that what we brought in, in size, does not replace Cally, Boyle, Poo. But again as I believe Fletch said the rangers are changing their type of game
Zil and Eco- I (also) only ment size up front, I am sorry for being unclear.
Size on the blueline is of course no big issue, nor was it last season. But our forward group will be real small next season.
6'3 Kreider-6'0 Step-6'4 Nash
6'1 Miller-6'0 Brassard-5'7 Zucc
5'11 Hags-5'11 Lombardi-5'7 MSL
6'1 Glass-6'0 Moore-5'11 Stempniak
Next season, who on the farm can bring size to that line-up? Nobody.
Druing all of last season, there was a ton of talk about us being small up-front. From the team we iced most of the year, we have lost our three biggest PFs, Pouliot, Cally and Boyle. We are -- substansially -- smaller this year up front than the team we iced last year, a team everyone thought was too small.
We are very soft and small up front. No help on the farm.
Any kid who scored 1.5+ PPG in the NCAA while being 6'4 225 lbs would undoubtedly get a long look here in NY and not be forgotten about.
Size on the blueline is of course no big issue, nor was it last season. But our forward group will be real small next season.
6'3 Kreider-6'0 Step-6'4 Nash
6'1 Miller-6'0 Brassard-5'7 Zucc
5'11 Hags-5'11 Lombardi-5'7 MSL
6'1 Glass-6'0 Moore-5'11 Stempniak
Next season, who on the farm can bring size to that line-up? Nobody.
Druing all of last season, there was a ton of talk about us being small up-front. From the team we iced most of the year, we have lost our three biggest PFs, Pouliot, Cally and Boyle. We are -- substansially -- smaller this year up front than the team we iced last year, a team everyone thought was too small.
We are very soft and small up front. No help on the farm.
Any kid who scored 1.5+ PPG in the NCAA while being 6'4 225 lbs would undoubtedly get a long look here in NY and not be forgotten about.
NYR Viper
Registered User
I think Haggerty and Lindberg who are both 6'0 have a good shot at making it at some point. Fast is 6'0. Kristo is 5'11.
The big addition, size-wise, is going to come on the back-end when McIlrath makes the jump.
I agree though, adding another player in the 6'3 range would help. Kreider and Nash are the only big forwards the Rangers have currently.
I don't follow, I think we are a lot smaller and softer.
Caly for MSL
Pouliot for Fast/Miller
Boyle for Stemp/Fast
Is that a bit smaller and softer?
NYR Viper
Registered User
Yes, but what does a full season of Klein for MDZ and Kreider being Kreider provide? What about Miller for Richards?
I think here is the differences:
MDZ for Klein (advantage Klein)
Pouliot for Stempniak (advantage Pouliot)
Boyle for Lombardi (advantage Boyle)
Richards for Miller (advantage Miller)
Kreider/Fast as rookies for Kreider (advantage Kreider in his 2nd year)
Dorsett for Glass (call it even)
I agree they lost some size, but Miller is more truculent than people give him credit for. If he can come in and win that 3rd center spot, that will help.
It is not cut and dried.
Stepan = intangibles, but extremely limited likelihood of improved physical play; has reached his ceiling as to speed, size, etc.
Miller = needs to acquire intangibles thru experience, but as someone else noted Kreider-Miller have played well together in the past.
Miller already offers Kreider to capitalize better on speed, not holding him back.
Then there is other linemate RW ?
I say put faster MSL w/faster guys, put Nash + Step together.
Unless we get Hayes (only cause we promised him a shot at a line with Kreider and that is magic.
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