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1998-2004 Rangers: Why were they so bad?

Randy Marsh

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Aug 20, 2012
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Looking at those rosters, they had a bunch of big-name former stars (and current stars) but couldn't seem to put it together. By comparison, the Flyers built their teams the same way, but made the playoffs every year.

"They signed too many big free agents" is likely true, but WHY is it true? Too many egos? Bad chemistry?
 
There was no organizational philosophy. There was a slew of terrible coaches. Their defense was nearly non-existent. There was a much deplored "country club" mentality, particularly after Messier came back.

On D... For example in 2000-01, the group consisted of Leetch, Johnsson, Pilon, Lefebvre, Malakhov, Purinton. Besides Lefebvre, who is playing high quality defense in that group?
 
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In addition to what Tawnos said, they kept signing big name forwards, while neglecting their defense. Poor Brian Leetch had nobody to help him on the blue line after Beukeboom was forced to retire and ended up playing way more minutes than he could handle as he was slowing down.

They also couldn't find a goalie between Richter and Lundqvist.
 
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My gosh, they were bad defensively. I remember watching them a bit in (I think) 02-03 or maybe it was 03-04, when the fans were chanting "Fire Sather!" every game. They were just sad.

Lack of team chemistry. No top-down structure from management. No defensive system; few good defencemen. Poor coaching (Bryan Trottier? Really, Slats...). Endless washed-up free agent signings.
 
I used to laugh hysterically here on HF (yes, it and I have been around that long) every summer during the free agency signing period, when NYR would sign the biggest names and everyone would swoon.

...And then reality would quickly set in each fall.

They "won" the Cup every July...when no one was playing. :laugh:
 
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Trottier said:
They "won" the Cup every July...when no one was playing. :laugh:
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Ya. Leafs same sort of thing including Draft Picks in June. The next Tim Horton or whatever....
and wow, just noticed when you pointed that out. Member here since 2002.

Awesome Trottier. :thumbu:
 
Trottier said:
I used to laugh hysterically here on HF (yes, it and I have been around that long) every summer during the free agency signing period, when NYR would sign the biggest names and everyone would swoon.

...And then reality would quickly set in each fall.

They "won" the Cup every July...when no one was playing. :laugh:
Click to expand...

Hehehe, me too but other boards. Hadn't discovered hfboards yet.
 
Why would anyone think they'd be good? It's not like those teams ever added young star players in their primes. Everyone they picked up was a has-been or was physically disintegrating.
 
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Zil said:
Why would anyone think they'd be good? It's not like those teams ever added young star players in their primes. Everyone they picked up was a has-been or was physically disintegrating.
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Their offense was good in 2000-01 (7th) and 2001-02 (11th), so there was room for hope. A comparison was drawn to the Flyers in the OP. Flyers were comparable offensively (11th, 8th) but also had Roman Cechmanek and allowed 500 fewer shots. If the Rangers would have had .920+ goaltending like that, they might have made the playoffs even with the extra SA.
 
1 Refusal to use any defensive system during the dead puck era. This was Sather's fault, he was famous for the way the Oilers played and he didn't want his team trapping.

2 Continuing to trade young talent for veterans and signing an endless list of UFA's to chase a second cup. The team always seemed to be getting older and that will eventually catch up with you. Dealing Zubov, Kovalev, Hlavac, Johnsson, Savard, Norstrom, etc. This was ownerships fault, Neil Smith eventually recognized that the team needed to be rebuilt and wanted to sell off the veterans and rebuild but ownership said no and wanted him to keep going the UFA route.

3 Long term or career ending injuries, bad luck, and bad choices.
Concussions: Richter, Beukeboom, Lafontaine, and Lindros.
Knee: Bure
Drugs: Stevens and Fleury

You can't miss the playoffs every year with the star players they did have without a little bit of bad luck, and losing key players at key times hurt.

In 04 they dumped all their veterans at the deadline for picks and prospects, and endorsed Tom Renney's defensive first system. They have made the playoffs 8 out of 9 years since then the one year missed was because they lost a shootout in the last game of the year.

Their 04 defense was much more talented than their 06 defense but the 06 team gave up 44 less goals even though League wide scoring had increased significantly, Lundqvist definitely deserves some credit but most goes to Tom Renney.

Leetch - Poti
Malakhov - Mironov
Kasparaitis - DeVries

vs

Malik - Roszival
Kaparaitis - Tyutin
Poti - Strudwick
 
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TheDevilMadeMe said:
I think getting Lundqvist in 2005-06 was the single biggest difference.

You're right that Renney was big too
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Also, Jagr came back from the lockout recharged and the league called a ton of penalties to try and cut down obstruction that year.
 
Zil said:
Also, Jagr came back from the lockout recharged and the league called a ton of penalties to try and cut down obstruction that year.
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Yes, that helped them make the playoffs no doubt at all. I was addressing their vastly improved defensive numbers which had little to do with Jagr. He was obviously a huge reason for their overall turn around though.
 
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That Bobby Holik contract sure was a special moment in Rangers history, as was the Quintal signing.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/hockey/nyr/2002-07-01-holik.htm
The complexion of both the New York Rangers and the New Jersey Devils changed dramatically Monday night, when Rangers President/GM Glen Sather stepped to the plate and stole center Bobby Holik with a five-year, $45-million contract.

The Rangers became meaner, more ornery and a lot more difficult for opponents to play; while the Devils got softer, smaller and less competitive. Sather called Holik "a unique player" and "our No. 1 absolute priority."

"He's a big domineering type of center," said Sather, who needed about 21 hours after the market opened to sign the first big-name free agent of his career as a GM.
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http://www.nytimes.com/2000/04/02/s...the-playoffs-suspend-disgruntled-quintal.html
The Rangers have three games left until their summer break. But Quintal's tenure with the Rangers appears to be over after one underachieving season. In 75 games, Quintal had 2 goals and 14 assists for 16 points with a plus-minus mark of minus-10.

Checketts, scheduled to join the Rangers in Washington on Monday, suspended Quintal on the advice of the assistant general manager, Don Maloney. In an interview with the French-language daily La Presse of Montreal earlier this week, Quintal said he erred in signing with the Rangers last summer and wanted to return to Montreal.

''My heart is in Montreal,'' Quintal was quoted as saying.

Quintal, 31, is from Boucherville, Quebec. He played with the Canadiens the last four seasons before signing a four-year, $11.4 million contract with the Rangers.

''All I know is he doesn't want to be a Ranger,'' John Tortorella, the interim coach of the Rangers, said before making his National Hockey League coaching debut today. ''What Mr. Checketts did is right. He sent him home.''
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Oh god, as a Devils fan, I loved seeing Holik miss the playoffs year after year, while John Madden seemlessly replaced him on the Devils, as they won the Cup the very next season
 
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^^^^^^
save for the exception above(which is awesome), I think the rangers hurt the teams they stole talent from moreso than they helped their own cause. even though it was fun to laugh at them attempt to build all star teams (with no chemistry) only to be golfing in april, i'm soooooo glad we have a hard cap.
 
I know that it didn't have any affect on the years mentioned, but trading Leetch and not letting him be a career Ranger was the dumbest thing Sather did in that timeframe
 
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bigbuffalo313 said:
I know that it didn't have any affect on the years mentioned, but trading Leetch and not letting him be a career Ranger was the dumbest thing Sather did in that timeframe
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Not even close. Leetch is pretty close to my all-time favorite. He had to be traded if the team was serious about building a youth movement, which they were.

Plus, there were plenty of actual dumb moves to choose from.
 
It would take a long post to go into enough detail to describe seven seasons of failure. But you know the phrase "build from the net out" in regard to building championship teams? Well the Rangers during that period built from the back page out. Lots of big names added to the Rangers by Smith and Sather that garnered headlines but they didn't get them playoff appearances. There was no clear organizational philosophy to guide the team's coaching and personnel decisions so the franchise was a mess. This meant signing strong performers from other teams that were actually successful to come to NY and be played in the wrong roles for disappointing Ranger careers. Just a string of veteran quick fixes with no desire to take the time to develop players within the organization.

We often hear about typical players for certain teams. A "typical Red Wings player" or a "typical Devils player."

What was a typical NYR player during that period?

Whoever was the biggest free agent July 1st.
 
Oh man, the teams of my childhood. I got into hockey during the Rangers' 96-97 season end/playoff run.

Then 7 seasons of death, a lockout, and then finally in 2006 I got to truly experience playoff hockey as an adult.

Yet every year of those dark years, I thought they would be good..

During the 2001-2002 season they were 1st in the conference in December (with a ton more games played than other teams though) and still didn't come close to making the playoffs in the end..

But as others have said, the main reason had to be the lack of commitment to defense, or any kind of defensive system.

I think the fact that I grew up during this era makes me so acceptable of the team today if they just contend.
 
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Who here remembers Christian Dube being hailed as The Next One by over zealous Rangers fans?

The Rangers were a pretty terrible team at prospect depth and player development.
 
Ziggy Stardust said:
Who here remembers Christian Dube being hailed as The Next One by over zealous Rangers fans?

The Rangers were a pretty terrible team at prospect depth and player development.
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Those Rangers fans were not overzealous. Your second point is totally on the mark. The Rangers asked Christian Dube to bulk up... a lot. He did, lost a step of footspeed in the process, and was never the same player after that. The team totally misjudged the player and basically ruined his potential.
 
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