1000 points, #99 and #100

[voyageur]

Conor Mc David is about to become the 99th 1000 point NHL player in history in the next weeks. Seems like a fitting honor.
The 100th 1000 point player in NHL history could be Nathan Mackinnon who is 71 points away. Brad Marchand is 59 points away from achieving that honor. Jamie Benn 86. Phil Kessel only 8, but still without a contract. Kucherov and Draisaitl may hit the mark next season.

There are currently 8 NHLers still playing who have achieved that milestone. Nickas Backstrom on LTIR, and recent retirees who have the mark include Bergeron, Marleau, Thornton and Getzlaf.

Fair to say that the NHL is in a renewed scoring era, and several generational talents of the game today will soon hit a milestone which was once synonymous with greatness. However the difference of eras sees many 80s and 90s players who hit the 1000 point mark outside of the HHoF, while players like Pavel Datsyuk get in with 918 points over a 14 year career.

Is 1000 points the mark of a good hockey career, should it be a standard for the HHoF forwards in the years to come?

Click to read more...

 

[The Panther]

Phil Kessel only 8, but still without a contract.

I didn't realize that. That's kind of sad.

I also always felt it a bit sad that Glenn Anderson walked away with 498 goals (and 1099 points!).

Fair to say that the NHL is in a renewed scoring era, and several generational talents of the game today will soon hit a milestone...

I hate to be that guy (again), but "generational" means (or should mean, logically) once-in-a-generation. Therefore, by its own definition, there cannot be "several generational talents" at once. Can we just say there are several great talents at present?

Is 1000 points the mark of a good hockey career, should it be a standard for the HHoF forwards in the years to come?

No, there should absolutely never be any raw number of anything that is "standard" for Hall of Fame admission. Goalposts change, scoring standards change, expectations of offensive / defensive players change, etc., etc. This is the kind of thinking that got Lanny McDonald and Dave Andreychuk in the Hall of Fame (at least Lanny was 2nd in goals once and 1st in ES goals... Andreychuk not so much).

Besides active / not-yet-eligible players, the 10 guys with the most scoring points who aren't in the Hall (yet) are:
1209 points -- Bernie Nicholls
1205 points -- Vincent Damphousse
1197 points -- Patrick Marleau
1184 points -- Rod Brind'Amour
1088 points -- Theoren Fleury
1069 points -- Dave Taylor
1065 points -- Keith Tkachuk
1064 points -- Ray Whitney
1062 points -- Pat Verbeek
1036 points -- Bobby Smith

I watched all of these guys play (Nicholls, Fleury, and Taylor were on the ice in the first NHL game I ever attended in person)... and not one of them strikes me as a clear Hall of Famer. There's an argument for three of four of them, but clearly there can be no "automatic" Hall entry if it's going to usher in Pat Verbeek and Ray Whitney (who were both very good players with long careers, but not Hall of Famers).

And I'm still scratching my head as to how Kevin Lowe and Phil Housley got in....

 

[McFlash97]

The most impressive part is , McDavid will hit a 1000 points while still only being 27 years of age

Just bonkers.

 

[The Panther]

The most impressive part is , McDavid will hit a 1000 points while still only being 27 years of age

Just bonkers.

It's amazing, but to put some perspective on that -- Wayne Gretzky became the all-time NHL assist leader one month after his 27th birthday. (He would have been 26 but for injury.)

 

[ItWasJustified]

I watched all of these guys play (Nicholls, Fleury, and Taylor were on the ice in the first NHL game I ever attended in person)... and not one of them strikes me as a clear Hall of Famer. There's an argument for three of four of them, but clearly there can be no "automatic" Hall entry if it's going to usher in Pat Verbeek and Ray Whitney (who were both very good players with long careers, but not Hall of Famers).

Just looking at total points is completely pointless. Points per game on the other hand...

 

[stahl]

And I'm still scratching my head as to how Kevin Lowe and Phil Housley got in....

Only 3 defensemen in NHL history have more points than Housley. It's easy to see how he got in.

 

[Matsun]

Kucherov needs to have a 127 point season to hit 1000 points. He'll need 104 points in the remaining 68 games and I think he'll do it.

 

[voyageur]

I didn't realize that. That's kind of sad.

I also always felt it a bit sad that Glenn Anderson walked away with 498 goals (and 1099 points!).

I hate to be that guy (again), but "generational" means (or should mean, logically) once-in-a-generation. Therefore, by its own definition, there cannot be "several generational talents" at once. Can we just say there are several great talents at present?

No, there should absolutely never be any raw number of anything that is "standard" for Hall of Fame admission. Goalposts change, scoring standards change, expectations of offensive / defensive players change, etc., etc. This is the kind of thinking that got Lanny McDonald and Dave Andreychuk in the Hall of Fame (at least Lanny was 2nd in goals once and 1st in ES goals... Andreychuk not so much).

Besides active / not-yet-eligible players, the 10 guys with the most scoring points who aren't in the Hall (yet) are:
1209 points -- Bernie Nicholls
1205 points -- Vincent Damphousse
1197 points -- Patrick Marleau
1184 points -- Rod Brind'Amour
1088 points -- Theoren Fleury
1069 points -- Dave Taylor
1065 points -- Keith Tkachuk
1064 points -- Ray Whitney
1062 points -- Pat Verbeek
1036 points -- Bobby Smith

I watched all of these guys play (Nicholls, Fleury, and Taylor were on the ice in the first NHL game I ever attended in person)... and not one of them strikes me as a clear Hall of Famer. There's an argument for three of four of them, but clearly there can be no "automatic" Hall entry if it's going to usher in Pat Verbeek and Ray Whitney (who were both very good players with long careers, but not Hall of Famers).

And I'm still scratching my head as to how Kevin Lowe and Phil Housley got in....

I don't know what the criteria is anymore for the HHoF. But Datsyuk getting over Brind'Amour? Not sure about that. Brind'Amour put up alot of points in the dead puck era. Lecavalier too. Patrik Elias. Bobby Smith had more Stanley Cup finals appearances than Datsyuk, he was a pretty good hockey player. If Dino Ciccarelli is in, Bobby Smith probably should be. I don't think the Sedins were great players, maybe on the PP, but they were first timers. Nicholls and Damphousse I think it's because they played for so many different teams.

You are going to see several players hit a 1000 points in the upcoming seasons. Mc David and Mackinnon will be higher up the boards by then, and Brian Propp will fall from the top 100 scorers of all time. Then I guess it's decide whether Patrice Bergeron is a HHoFer, Marchand, Pasternak, Panarin, Scheifele.

If you are going by Selke trophies, I think that trophy has been rigged by big market teams for years.

 

[Toby91ca]

The most impressive part is , McDavid will hit a 1000 points while still only being 27 years of age

Just bonkers.

Not quite as bonkers as Gretzky doing it while still being only 23.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Kucherov needs to have a 127 point season to hit 1000 points. He'll need 104 points in the remaining 68 games and I think he'll do it.

Tampa hasn't played any games against Montreal yet, so he can probably get those 127 points in those games

 

[Toby91ca]

Just looking at total points is completely pointless. Points per game on the other hand...

Points per game is still not as great of a measure when you are comparing players from different generations though.

 

[Calderon]

Maybe a little harsh of a concept cos people would get their feelings hurt but what if the HHOF had a set number of membership places? The hall could expand with every "generation" or even yearly to accommodate talent of younger generations but the gist would be that for new members to be inducted the bottom of the barrel would need to make space most years. This would ensure some of the more undeserving past inductees wouldn't bring the standard down too much. There would be no slipping slope phenomenon ("well if Dino Ciccarelli and Kevin Lowe got in then this guy certainly has a case!").

 

[voyageur]

Maybe a little harsh of a concept cos people would get their feelings hurt but what if the HHOF had a set number of membership places? The hall could expand with every "generation" or even yearly to accommodate talent of younger generations but the gist would be that for new members to be inducted the bottom of the barrel would need to make space most years. This would ensure some of the more undeserving past inductees wouldn't bring the standard down too much. There would be no slipping slope phenomenon ("well if Dino Ciccarelli and Kevin Lowe got in then this guy certainly has a case!").

I think for the older generations it will be very difficult to get in. There are a lot of potential HHoF players on the horizon, especially when the likes of Kane, Malkin, Kopitar,etc. retire. Jagr is now 3 years away. I think there is something to be said for playing for a marquee (Original Six franchise) team, in that you get more exposure.

The defense part I can't figure out. Weber first time hall of fame, Chara next. Sergei Gonchar still not in. After guys like Letang, Hedman, Karlsson and Burns retire, they should all get in.

It's a shame when older players never get that chance to be listed among hockey's greats, simply because of the era they played in. I think for JR, he was such a colorful person, that he knew this might be his only chance.

 

[Forge]

Just looking at total points is completely pointless. Points per game on the other hand...

As someone else said, can't even really do that because of the way the eras have gone.

Being a .9 ppg player in the 80's is vastly different than being a .9 ppg player from the mid 90's to mid 00's

 

[voyageur]

Kucherov needs to have a 127 point season to hit 1000 points. He'll need 104 points in the remaining 68 games and I think he'll do it.

I don't think so, but you never know. I think Brad Marchand is a safer bet to become the 101st player to hit 1000 points, might even get there before Mackinnon. That you have so many players hitting this milestone now is a testament to the skill level of hockey today, combined with increased efficiency on the PP.