GDT: 10/23/21 - 7:00PM EDT - Colorado vs Tampa Bay

[YayHockeysBack]

I'd like to see next game:

Palat - Point - ABB
Killorn - Stamkos - Joseph
Colton - Cirelli - Joseph

or if ABB doesn't dress

Palat - Point - Stamkos
Killorn - Colton - Joseph
Maroon - Cirelli - Perry

We gotta try something to lengthen the lineup. For one I'd continue to reward Joseph who's creating chances, and move Cirelli down who's not suited for a top 6 role. He can be a terrific 2 way player, but he's never going to give us the offense we want. Maybe if we spread it out and put him on his own line, you can take advantage of a matchup. That would also immediately make the 3rd line a lot better. Gotta find solutions to get more offense out of this lineup.

I agree with this, especially the part about Cirelli. I'm pretty much done with him, unless he wants to play the Yanni Gourde role as a shut-down guy who you don't count on to score much. Get him off the top two lines where he's just an anchor.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

I agree with this, especially the part about Cirelli. I'm pretty much done with him, unless he wants to play the Yanni Gourde role as a shut-down guy who you don't count on to score much. Get him off the top two lines where he's just an anchor.

Right now I’m open to anything. Look at a guy like Yanni Gourde. Started his career in the top 6 with back to back 20+ goal seasons, he was on our 4th line with Maroon and Paquette in 2019 when we went to Stockholm, and then on the 3rd line for the 2020 and 2021 playoff runs. Guys need to be whatever we need them to be and if you have to move “top 6 guys” down the lineup, so be it.

 

[T REX]

No lead in regulation.

I don't want to see another FB, tweet or instgram of a ring the rest of the year.

Too much back patting and not enough focus.

Last year is gone. No one cares. Time to step up or step aside.

 

[T REX]

Should have gotten that 2nd point.

- Tampa is the only team to not score in the 1st period
- Tampa has not led a single game
- Tampa has not won at home yet

Post of the day.

Too much congratulating. Living in the past.

 

[Stammertime91]

Man I was pumped for Raddysh to make the team but I don't think he's touched the puck since preseason.

We looked better in the 3rd but it's still in the combos. 5/6 in the bottom 6 have worse finishing than JT Brown. Too many passenger type grinders in one unit.

 

[Todd1a]

Man I was pumped for Raddysh to make the team but I don't think he's touched the puck since preseason.

We looked better in the 3rd but it's still in the combos. 5/6 in the bottom 6 have worse finishing than JT Brown. Too many passenger type grinders in one unit.

don’t even ever notice him doing anything

 

[Sky04]

Raddysh has really unimpressed at the pro level. Seems like he just hit a big wall after juniors. I like Katchouk a little better because he's got speed and skill, just needs to put it together.

 

[Sky04]

I'd like to see next game:

Palat - Point - ABB
Killorn - Stamkos - Joseph
Colton - Cirelli - Perry

or if ABB doesn't dress

Palat - Point - Stamkos
Killorn - Colton - Joseph
Maroon - Cirelli - Perry

We gotta try something to lengthen the lineup. For one I'd continue to reward Joseph who's creating chances, and move Cirelli down who's not suited for a top 6 role. He can be a terrific 2 way player, but he's never going to give us the offense we want. Maybe if we spread it out and put him on his own line, you can take advantage of a matchup. That would also immediately make the 3rd line a lot better. Gotta find solutions to get more offense out of this lineup.

You need to keep the Point and Stamkos together, Stamkos with Joseph and Killorn is asking for nothing, none of those guys can get Stamkos the puck and he's been the best forward this year.

You can rotate anyone else I don't think you're going to get far playing Point with a rookie and a guy struggling to finish and Stamkos with 2 grinders.

 

[LightningStrikes]

No lead in regulation.

I don't want to see another FB, tweet or instgram of a ring the rest of the year.

Too much back patting and not enough focus.

Last year is gone. No one cares. Time to step up or step aside.

Cooper said the ring ceremony was the last time they’ll talk about last season. We saw the effort last night, I think the main task now is to figure out the lines and get them to gel.

 

[DFC]

Pretty solid game for us really. Would have been nice to get a few calls. Happy that the compete level is showing up, at least.

 

[DaBolts]

Tough finish but a much better outing from the boys. Let's hope we start to improve our offense and forechecking a bit more to keep the pressure off the back end.

 

[DFC]

Tough finish but a much better outing from the boys. Let's hope we start to improve our offense and forechecking a bit more to keep the pressure off the back end.

I think the offense did show up last night. Kuemper is an underrated goalie, IMO, and we might have had 6 if he were average.

 

[Byrddog]

I'd like to see next game:

Palat - Point - ABB
Killorn - Stamkos - Joseph
Colton - Cirelli - Perry

or if ABB doesn't dress

Palat - Point - Stamkos
Killorn - Colton - Joseph
Maroon - Cirelli - Perry

We gotta try something to lengthen the lineup. For one I'd continue to reward Joseph who's creating chances, and move Cirelli down who's not suited for a top 6 role. He can be a terrific 2 way player, but he's never going to give us the offense we want. Maybe if we spread it out and put him on his own line, you can take advantage of a matchup. That would also immediately make the 3rd line a lot better. Gotta find solutions to get more offense out of this lineup.

I am not sure adding another young guy will do much but theres not much choice now. The bottom 6 are just not talented enough to play up, with the exception of maybe Colton. No one wanted to listen to my concerns preseason about the scoring ability of the roster but oh well. Now we took the Kuch hit and the wheels have all but fallen off. This is a 1 line team right now and last night it was not enough. Stammer and Point are putting up points down stream they are not getting the help we enjoyed the last three years. If the top line does not pot two a night right now we are going to struggle to win against the better teams. Even without Kuch there is no reason this team should be 0-10 on the PP in the last two games. Really the closest they were to scoring on the PP was Nipples who did not elevate the puck. I fully expect that the PP is going to change to an umbrella with Heddy, Sergi blasting from the blueline and the rest trying to cleanup rebounds until Kuch returns.

I get why people like to watch Joseph he gives 100% but the guy is going to end up on the IR if he can not keep his head up. That hit last night could have been avoided. Just watch the way he skates and works the boards his head is down most of the time on the other hand watch Point who is just as fast but his head is up allowing him to avoid hits like Joseph had and to create. Yes Joseph will occasionally score but do not think his speed transfers to talent. Case in point he had two shorthanded breakaways against Florida and was not even close to scoring. Exciting yes, but not the answer either.

This is a tough situation we have expectations but things are out of Sync. Started in preseason not playing the roster enough to knock the rust off before starting the season. Of course thats the time to look at young guys but IMO teams have to limit that. Vasi is struggling some now and maybe a few periods preseason would of helped him, he will get ion track he has to because we are going to need him at less than 2.0 GAA with the output we have now.

 

[DFC]

I am not sure adding another young guy will do much but theres not much choice now. The bottom 6 are just not talented enough to play up, with the exception of maybe Colton. No one wanted to listen to my concerns preseason about the scoring ability of the roster but oh well. Now we took the Kuch hit and the wheels have all but fallen off. This is a 1 line team right now and last night it was not enough. Stammer and Point are putting up points down stream they are not getting the help we enjoyed the last three years. If the top line does not pot two a night right now we are going to struggle to win against the better teams. Even without Kuch there is no reason this team should be 0-10 on the PP in the last two games. Really the closest they were to scoring on the PP was Nipples who did not elevate the puck. I fully expect that the PP is going to change to an umbrella with Heddy, Sergi blasting from the blueline and the rest trying to cleanup rebounds until Kuch returns.

I get why people like to watch Joseph he gives 100% but the guy is going to end up on the IR if he can not keep his head up. That hit last night could have been avoided. Just watch the way he skates and works the boards his head is down most of the time on the other hand watch Point who is just as fast but his head is up allowing him to avoid hits like Joseph had and to create. Yes Joseph will occasionally score but do not think his speed transfers to talent. Case in point he had two shorthanded breakaways against Florida and was not even close to scoring. Exciting yes, but not the answer either.

This is a tough situation we have expectations but things are out of Sync. Started in preseason not playing the roster enough to knock the rust off before starting the season. Of course thats the time to look at young guys but IMO teams have to limit that. Vasi is struggling some now and maybe a few periods preseason would of helped him, he will get ion track he has to because we are going to need him at less than 2.0 GAA with the output we have now.

I mean, we've had a lot of turnover though, with a lot of guys in new roles, a lot of guys new to the team, and the vets (other than Stamkos) looking like they are just now getting into game shape. It was a recipe for a bad start, and we've had exactly that. I'm not sure if any real conclusions can be drawn until a couple of months from now though.

 

[The Gongshow]

If Cirelli even thinks he's getting a big raise he can walk. Guy has 0 scoring ability since his rookie season.

I agree his role should be a shutdown guy, he's a great PKer but damn he's been disappointing

 

[Sky04]

If Cirelli even thinks he's getting a big raise he can walk. Guy has 0 scoring ability since his rookie season.

I agree his role should be a shutdown guy, he's a great PKer but damn he's been disappointing

A guy who has 4 points in 5 games should be a pure shutdown guy what?

 

[JTBF81]

I am not sure adding another young guy will do much but theres not much choice now. The bottom 6 are just not talented enough to play up, with the exception of maybe Colton. No one wanted to listen to my concerns preseason about the scoring ability of the roster but oh well. Now we took the Kuch hit and the wheels have all but fallen off. This is a 1 line team right now and last night it was not enough. Stammer and Point are putting up points down stream they are not getting the help we enjoyed the last three years. If the top line does not pot two a night right now we are going to struggle to win against the better teams. Even without Kuch there is no reason this team should be 0-10 on the PP in the last two games. Really the closest they were to scoring on the PP was Nipples who did not elevate the puck. I fully expect that the PP is going to change to an umbrella with Heddy, Sergi blasting from the blueline and the rest trying to cleanup rebounds until Kuch returns.

I get why people like to watch Joseph he gives 100% but the guy is going to end up on the IR if he can not keep his head up. That hit last night could have been avoided. Just watch the way he skates and works the boards his head is down most of the time on the other hand watch Point who is just as fast but his head is up allowing him to avoid hits like Joseph had and to create. Yes Joseph will occasionally score but do not think his speed transfers to talent. Case in point he had two shorthanded breakaways against Florida and was not even close to scoring. Exciting yes, but not the answer either.

This is a tough situation we have expectations but things are out of Sync. Started in preseason not playing the roster enough to knock the rust off before starting the season. Of course thats the time to look at young guys but IMO teams have to limit that. Vasi is struggling some now and maybe a few periods preseason would of helped him, he will get ion track he has to because we are going to need him at less than 2.0 GAA with the outpuy we have now.

The offense will get there, and yeah, losing Kuch hurts. Take away any team's #1 player for 2+ months and see what happens. Plenty of ppl heard your doom saying before the season, but given the team's cap constraints, JBB did all that he could to ice a solid roster. They could have sacrificed McD to keep Gourde and maybe Goodrow, but keeping the defense intact was of higher importance.

As far as other players lost, Johnson was also always gone, so the team was going to have to figure some things out on offense with a mostly new bottom 6. I'm not sure what more JBB could have done tbh this past offseason to keep or bring better guys in.

Both the defense and Vasi need to play better, while a younger and weaker(in the bottom 6 anyway) offense takes time to figure out their best options. So far, that hasn't happened much, and the team has struggled to start. If they are still a .500 team(or worse) after 20 games , then there could be some reason for real concern and roster changes perhaps.

For now, have to be patient and believe they will figure it out enough until Kuch returns. Even Joseph, who I have been pretty critical of, had a much better game last night. If he can play like that more and avoid getting hurt, he'll likely be a big boost to the team. Hopefully, ABB will also start to contribute, which will further mitigate the temporary loss of Kuch. Katchouk at least has been ok in his bottom 6 role, while Raddysh has been rather disappointing.

 

[bigdaddio]

What is up with Cirelli? He is legitimately worse than his rookie season. I heard from a completely unverified source (i.e. a guy playing poker who claimed to work with Lightning) that he's hitting the clubs too much. Any truth to this?

 

[Flat Ronnie]

For the love of God, dont split up Point and Stamkos right now. They're the only true scoring threat we have.

As a matter of fact, when Kuch gets back, try him on the 2nd line instead of moving Stammer back. If Stamkos is working on that 1st line then see if Kuch can generate some offense with Killorn and Cirelli. Lord knows they couldn't get the puck to Stamkos.

 

[DFC]

For the love of God, dont split up Point and Stamkos right now. They're the only true scoring threat we have.

As a matter of fact, when Kuch gets back, try him on the 2nd line instead of moving Stammer back. If Stamkos is working on that 1st line then see if Kuch can generate some offense with Killorn and Cirelli. Lord knows they couldn't get the puck to Stamkos.

Honestly I can't remember ever pairing Kuch and cirelli and I'm not sure why. Kuch would turn him into a threat I think.

 

[Rschmitz]

Good game, I feel like that has been our best effort yet this season.

 

[Byrddog]

The offense will get there, and yeah, losing Kuch hurts. Take away any team's #1 player for 2+ months and see what happens. Plenty of ppl heard your doom saying before the season, but given the team's cap constraints, JBB did all that he could to ice a solid roster. They could have sacrificed McD to keep Gourde and maybe Goodrow, but keeping the defense intact was of higher importance.

As far as other players lost, Johnson was also always gone, so the team was going to have to figure some things out on offense with a mostly new bottom 6. I'm not sure what more JBB could have done tbh this past offseason to keep or bring better guys in.

Both the defense and Vasi need to play better, while a younger and weaker(in the bottom 6 anyway) offense takes time to figure out their best options. So far, that hasn't happened much, and the team has struggled to start. If they are still a .500 team(or worse) after 20 games , then there could be some reason for real concern and roster changes perhaps.

For now, have to be patient and believe they will figure it out enough until Kuch returns. Even Joseph, who I have been pretty critical of, had a much better game last night. If he can play like that more and avoid getting hurt, he'll likely be a big boost to the team. Hopefully, ABB will also start to contribute, which will further mitigate the temporary loss of Kuch. Katchouk at least has been ok in his bottom 6 role, while Raddysh has been rather disappointing.

You point of view took a hit last night. We got beat soundly by Buffalo. As I said before we are now a one line team. And last night they did not show up. They can not depend on a one threat of Stammers slapper from the circle. How many did he take against Buffalo, Anderson stopped every one of the. Why? When thats the biggest threat the goalie can focus on it. Point On Kuch's side removes him from the center where he is effective. Using the CAP constraints to weaken the offense by 4 players who were productive in there roles was a mistake given the young guys and the two non productive veterans signed. Looking back on the off season Both Cirelli and Sergi should have been traded and If Seattle still took Gourde you could have put Johnson back to the 2C Colton the 3C. This would have freed enough money to keep Coleman who is a warrior and sign upgrades to Perry and BelleMare.

As to the defense the Buffalo game was there worst performance They are missing the Gourde line IMO and to a point last years 4th line both of those lines shut down a lot helping the D. Now VAsi has to be better now of the 6 games so far we have scored more than two goals just twice. And honestly with the roster right now a 3 goal night is going to be the focus and Vasi has to keep us in the game. I know hard for many here to stomach since this has been a high flying goal scoring machine. How Coop matches lines needs to be massaged too how often do you see Stammer and Point, Heddy -4 and 3 more players -2.

The common opinion about our young guys is wrong and the Buffalo game shows. There young guys have a lot better game than ours. ABB had his best game IMO last night he was not as lost but he is still a way off being a top 6 guy here. Raddish and Katchouk have had moments but not impressive since preseason.

Now the PP once again another game 0 for, they have falled to 15% thats 24th in the league. That is unsustainable with the success we want. Yes it is 6 games but the PP looks bad on top of being ineffective. From the practice lines this morning not much has changed except it looks like ABB will be a scratch. The 2nd PP unit again has Cirelli on the Wing with MAroon on the other and Colton and Nipples is on the 1stPP so I do not expect anything from the PP tonight again.

Now you think time will turn this around how much time? 20 games? With the current performance after 20 games the hole may be too big to dig out of when Kuch returns. And who is the next player we are gonna lose being hurt? It is killing us none of the bottom 6 can play up. JBB should have known this in the offseason. Of course he had to get under the CAP but they way he did it gutted the secondary scoring which kills you when a star goes down. This happens to many teams I have seen it over and over in the last 50 years and its even more critical in the CAP world.

 

[JTBF81]

You point of view took a hit last night. We got beat soundly by Buffalo. As I said before we are now a one line team. And last night they did not show up. They can not depend on a one threat of Stammers slapper from the circle. How many did he take against Buffalo, Anderson stopped every one of the. Why? When thats the biggest threat the goalie can focus on it. Point On Kuch's side removes him from the center where he is effective. Using the CAP constraints to weaken the offense by 4 players who were productive in there roles was a mistake given the young guys and the two non productive veterans signed. Looking back on the off season Both Cirelli and Sergi should have been traded and If Seattle still took Gourde you could have put Johnson back to the 2C Colton the 3C. This would have freed enough money to keep Coleman who is a warrior and sign upgrades to Perry and BelleMare.

As to the defense the Buffalo game was there worst performance They are missing the Gourde line IMO and to a point last years 4th line both of those lines shut down a lot helping the D. Now VAsi has to be better now of the 6 games so far we have scored more than two goals just twice. And honestly with the roster right now a 3 goal night is going to be the focus and Vasi has to keep us in the game. I know hard for many here to stomach since this has been a high flying goal scoring machine. How Coop matches lines needs to be massaged too how often do you see Stammer and Point, Heddy -4 and 3 more players -2.

The common opinion about our young guys is wrong and the Buffalo game shows. There young guys have a lot better game than ours. ABB had his best game IMO last night he was not as lost but he is still a way off being a top 6 guy here. Raddish and Katchouk have had moments but not impressive since preseason.

Now the PP once again another game 0 for, they have falled to 15% thats 24th in the league. That is unsustainable with the success we want. Yes it is 6 games but the PP looks bad on top of being ineffective. From the practice lines this morning not much has changed except it looks like ABB will be a scratch. The 2nd PP unit again has Cirelli on the Wing with MAroon on the other and Colton and Nipples is on the 1stPP so I do not expect anything from the PP tonight again.

Now you think time will turn this around how much time? 20 games? With the current performance after 20 games the hole may be too big to dig out of when Kuch returns. And who is the next player we are gonna lose being hurt? It is killing us none of the bottom 6 can play up. JBB should have known this in the offseason. Of course he had to get under the CAP but they way he did it gutted the secondary scoring which kills you when a star goes down. This happens to many teams I have seen it over and over in the last 50 years and its even more critical in the CAP world.

Stopped reading when your idea to improve the team was to move Cirelli and Serg. The idea was to improve, not cripple the future of the team thanks.

 

[Byrddog]

Stopped reading when your idea to improve the team was to move Cirelli and Serg. The idea was to improve, not cripple the future of the team thanks.

Yet the secondary scoring for the team is crippled now by retaining those two. Your refusal to comprehend the implications is impressive. There is not one other team in the league that has three players like Heddy, Mac and Sergi on one side of the D three guys that are top pairing players. Two of which have NMC and NTC long term. Then you defend keeping Cirelli in a role he is not excelling at. He is paid as a 2C yet he has not broken 50 points or 20 goals. And last night Coop moved him to wing trying to get a spark in offense. I would love the ability to keep Sergi but next contract can't see how because he is going to be due a nice raise. Continuing to group cap into players you can not keep long term is what put the offense into the predicament they are in now. While they scored 5 last night which was a great thing psychologically for the fans it is not sustainable. Not one goal came from depth scoring you might argue that Mac's was but he is paid as part of the big boys so he is expected to score. But We can not count on Palat, Stammer, Point and Killorn scoring every night each having 60 goals is just not going to happen. You put much of the blame on Vasi for his slow start and that is a good point but he played well last night but if the team is only scoring 1 or two goals like they were VAsi needs to be perfect with a 1.25 and .950 and thats not going to happen wither. The shortfall is depth scoring PED, Nipples and the Kids are not chipping in at all. while they might look good I do not see any of them approaching 20 goals. Just think where we would be if JBB had traded Killorn too as you wanted. Subtracting offense without replacing it with talented young players who can contribute at a level of the subtractions has hurt. Now can Coop overcome it im not saying he can't but his back is against the wall. The big hope was that Cirelli and Joseph could make up some of the loss but they are the same players offensively as they have been in the past. Joseph will likely have 10 to 15 goals and 35 points Cirelli will probably end up with 15 goals and 40 points.

 

[JTBF81]

Yet the secondary scoring for the team is crippled now by retaining those two. Your refusal to comprehend the implications is impressive. There is not one other team in the league that has three players like Heddy, Mac and Sergi on one side of the D three guys that are top pairing players. Two of which have NMC and NTC long term. Then you defend keeping Cirelli in a role he is not excelling at. He is paid as a 2C yet he has not broken 50 points or 20 goals. And last night Coop moved him to wing trying to get a spark in offense. I would love the ability to keep Sergi but next contract can't see how because he is going to be due a nice raise. Continuing to group cap into players you can not keep long term is what put the offense into the predicament they are in now. While they scored 5 last night which was a great thing psychologically for the fans it is not sustainable. Not one goal came from depth scoring you might argue that Mac's was but he is paid as part of the big boys so he is expected to score. But We can not count on Palat, Stammer, Point and Killorn scoring every night each having 60 goals is just not going to happen. You put much of the blame on Vasi for his slow start and that is a good point but he played well last night but if the team is only scoring 1 or two goals like they were VAsi needs to be perfect with a 1.25 and .950 and thats not going to happen wither. The shortfall is depth scoring PED, Nipples and the Kids are not chipping in at all. while they might look good I do not see any of them approaching 20 goals. Just think where we would be if JBB had traded Killorn too as you wanted. Subtracting offense without replacing it with talented young players who can contribute at a level of the subtractions has hurt. Now can Coop overcome it im not saying he can't but his back is against the wall. The big hope was that Cirelli and Joseph could make up some of the loss but they are the same players offensively as they have been in the past. Joseph will likely have 10 to 15 goals and 35 points Cirelli will probably end up with 15 goals and 40 points.

Lol, so your idea of a better team would've been trade Cirelli and Serg for futures and/or prospects, then have either protected Gourde with a 7+3 list, or still lost him while keeping Johnson and Coleman. So basically, keep 2 other ~5 million players(either overpaid or an anchor outside of maybe Gourde), while still having no money for any depth defensively or in the bottom 6. Yeah, your idea would've had the team looking far worse both defensively this year and, with several more bloated and aging contracts, worse on offense down the line. Plain and simple, JBB valued keeping a great defense together and knew that younger players would need to step up over the next few years to support the core. Good thing they have a couple this year, and it looks like a few more with potential on the way in the.next couple of years. Your roster would've been no better, just weaker in different areas and with more overpaid contracts.